Your cruise dose

Pumped1 · Aug 12, 2023

25mg ed is my cruise
levels are over 1100
some gh or gh peptides
that's it , I am feeling good !

qbkilla · Aug 12, 2023

Random question...which of these approaches would probably be healthier and which would result in a better final physique?

Guy a 300 mg test year round

Guy b cruises at 150 then ramps blasts up to 450, averages 300 same as guy a.

Tomgrass · Aug 12, 2023

qbkilla said:
Random question...which of these approaches would probably be healthier and which would result in a better final physique?

Guy a 300 mg test year round

Guy b cruises at 150 then ramps blasts up to 450, averages 300 same as guy a.

Second option.

pickapeck · Aug 12, 2023

bbryan7419 said:
I stay on low trt when I’m not on a cycle to avoid sides. Sure I could drop everything and do PCT to get my body to fully generate test again but at low dose test my body is still producing test I’m just adding a little to it. I feel so much better on low test than nothing at all. Even low test helps w recovery.

Brother it doesn't work like that. I don't have the papers on hand but as little as 60 mg/w completely shut down endogenous production according to one paper. I think you can add in hCG once a week and get the boys rolling a little bit. i don't have bloods to prove it, but whenever I added Nolvadex or Clomid to a low cycle or TRT my testes plump up a bit. Now does that translate into endo test production? I don't know. I did cycle on and off for decades and my T production always came back into normal range eventually, that is until my late 50s but it could be that it would still come back but more than 5 months waiting just became unreasonable to me. So, it can be done given enough time and given that you didn't start using until at least your mid 20s. But hey, if you're in your late 50s or older probably pushing in enough to get you to 800 ng/dL or so is going to make a world of difference.

pickapeck · Aug 12, 2023

qbkilla said:
Random question...which of these approaches would probably be healthier and which would result in a better final physique?

Guy a 300 mg test year round

Guy b cruises at 150 then ramps blasts up to 450, averages 300 same as guy a.

Given all other variables the same, I'd say Guy b since his system will re-sensitize to some extent.

Big Dave Smith · Aug 12, 2023

tren_plz said:
This will come off as being a dick, but i'd really like to see some photos of ppl with these heavy as 'cruises'. No hate, i love gear too. Its fun! But some of these are down right alarming and none of you look like Luki...

I get it, you dont want to lose what you've worked for....I came off everything to get my Wife pregnant 6 months. When i got back on 300mg test it was like running my first cycle again.

@BDS pretty much spot on with my thoughts. Your body is going to respond best when its healthy. Its just like being insulin sensitive...could be bro science, but i've seen it first hand with my circle of friends.

This is my most recent pic, for a reference.
5’8.5”, 266.

luki7788 · Aug 12, 2023

Big Dave Smith said:
This is my most recent pic, for a reference.
5’8.5”, 266.

I don't think he was talking about you when he wrote this post

because you're a real pro and I'm just a guy who tries to be a freak and I don't even want someone to compare me with you because I'm from a lower league and you're one of the people on the forum that I respect and admire a lot

Big Dave Smith · Aug 12, 2023

tren_plz said:
This will come off as being a dick, but i'd really like to see some photos of ppl with these heavy as 'cruises'. No hate, i love gear too. Its fun! But some of these are down right alarming and none of you look like Luki...

I get it, you dont want to lose what you've worked for....I came off everything to get my Wife pregnant 6 months. When i got back on 300mg test it was like running my first cycle again.

@BDS pretty much spot on with my thoughts. Your body is going to respond best when its healthy. Its just like being insulin sensitive...could be bro science, but i've seen it first hand with my circle of friends.

Swifto said:
What a fantastic post.

How do you incorporate your TRT dose with your diet phases?

For example, do you TRT/cruise when dieting, then ramp things up when bulking or during offseason, or vice versa?

I don’t. It’s possible that if someone is trying to do something big nationally, maybe a long cycle would need a moment in the middle where drugs are reduced before a final hard push.

If I’m cycling “today”, I’m trying to grow or cut. Protein is typically 350-400g (personal sweet spot for either), and the rest of my calories/macros are adjusted slowly over time. If I’m dropping to TRT, protein is 250-300g and using maintenance calories for fat/carb.

I have had 2 periods of my life where I bulked on 1cc of test with a hefty dose of peptides, but mostly because I stayed on gear longer than I thought was appropriate before and after each period. This was when I competed, so I’d stay on cycle for 5-6 months at a time.

Swifto · Aug 12, 2023

luki7788 said:
I don't think he was talking about you when he wrote this post

because you're a real pro and I'm just a guy who tries to be a freak and I don't even want someone to compare me with you because I'm from a lower league and you're one of the people on the forum that I respect and admire a lot

Have you tried Big Dave Smith approach using a lot lower cruise doses?

luki7788 · Aug 12, 2023

Swifto said:
Have you tried Big Dave Smith approach using a lot lower cruise doses?

I don't like low doses - sorry

buck · Aug 12, 2023

bbryan7419 said:
I stay on low trt when I’m not on a cycle to avoid sides. Sure I could drop everything and do PCT to get my body to fully generate test again but at low dose test my body is still producing test I’m just adding a little to it. I feel so much better on low test than nothing at all. Even low test helps w recovery.

That is not my experience nor what i have read. As soon as your body senses that there is outside T coming in it will lower production to a level that is where it thinks it should be whether we like it or not. When i first started TRT the Dr' put me on a transdermal that should have given me 5mg/day after it was absorbed. My LH and FSH levels were near zero from that. And my blood levels of T were only slightly higher then from pre TRT. So my body compensated from the additional T by shutting down it's own production.

MrWhisper · Aug 12, 2023

Just started cruising instead of pct this year. I now cruise at 180mg every wk split in 2 injections.

I have felt great at this dose so far. I have heard of cruising with low dose GH which sounds good to me but would have to budget it to figure out what it would cost me to do this?

bbryan7419 · Aug 12, 2023

buck said:
That is not my experience nor what i have read. As soon as your body senses that there is outside T coming in it will lower production to a level that is where it thinks it should be whether we like it or not. When i first started TRT the Dr' put me on a transdermal that should have given me 5mg/day after it was absorbed. My LH and FSH levels were near zero from that. And my blood levels of T were only slightly higher then from pre TRT. So my body compensated from the additional T by shutting down it's own production.

I’m on clomid to help my body produce its own test still. I stopped taking clomid for a few months and my test dropped a lot.

buck · Aug 12, 2023

bbryan7419 said:
I’m on clomid to help my body produce its own test still. I stopped taking clomid for a few months and my test dropped a lot.

That is what i would expect. And points back to what i wrote.

bbryan7419 · Aug 12, 2023

buck said:
That is what i would expect. And points back to what i wrote.

I’m just saying my natural test isn’t completely dormant while on trt.

buck · Aug 12, 2023

bbryan7419 said:
I’m just saying my natural test isn’t completely dormant while on trt.

Most people will produce something. I know of no one that had a level of zero when they started TRT. But there is no way to know how much if any you are producing once you add an outside source of T as your body cuts back on production. And there is no way to differentiate ones own T from supplied T that i know of. when i started TRT my levels were about 425. Once 5mg/day were added they ended up at 500. So most all my T production i was making stopped after i started TRT as 5mg should have produced higher results then 75 points.

Swifto · Aug 12, 2023

buck said:
That is not my experience nor what i have read. As soon as your body senses that there is outside T coming in it will lower production to a level that is where it thinks it should be whether we like it or not. When i first started TRT the Dr' put me on a transdermal that should have given me 5mg/day after it was absorbed. My LH and FSH levels were near zero from that. And my blood levels of T were only slightly higher then from pre TRT. So my body compensated from the additional T by shutting down it's own production.

It doesnt take much exogenous testosterone to cause HPTA "shutdown" at all.

The hypothalamus will sense the increase in androgen and estrogen levels and suppression will start and lead to hypogonadism.

Swifto · Aug 12, 2023

bbryan7419 said:
I’m just saying my natural test isn’t completely dormant while on trt.

How do you know your "natural test isn't completely dormant"?

If its not, your LH and FSH would have to be higher too.

Ive seen this talked about, but never really seen any clinical data supporting this theory.

Likely the changes in total testosterone are either:

1. Taking bloods at different times after the exogenous testosterone shot

2. Not allowing supra physiological doses of testosterone to clear and these still showing up as TT. If you have ran a big stack before, it will take 4-6 weeks for androgen levels to return to baseline

3. Changing of Testosterone esters

4. HCG increasing intra-testicular testosterone (ITT)

5. Under dosed, over dosed, fake Test

I will add that there was talk about the opiod antagonist Naltrexone years ago as it had promise in maintaining GnRH and therefore LH and FSH, but I'm not sure how applicable this was. Research chem sites did pick it up, but I have no clue of its effectiveness or popularity.