ARB's (ex: Telmisartan) + SGLT2 (ex: Empagliflozin/Jardiance) are god's gift to bodybuilders

[slesh]

@nothuman throwing heat!

 

[Chipper Jones78]

@nothuman throwing heat!

He is without a doubt, one of the more comprehensive minds on this board when it comes to medication, mind, wellness and longevity.

 

[slesh]

He is without a doubt, one of the more comprehensive minds on this board when it comes to medication, mind, wellness and longevity.

That’s why he’s my anti-aging consigliere

 

[bbxtreme]

Just incase anyone still thinks an ARB will cause you to lose muscle or inhibit your ability to gain muscle (hypertrophy) I have posted the additional studies below. Humans and rats just for good measure and to not be biased.

If there are studies to directly support the counter argument I'm all ears.

I can add more if needed, but the last thing we need is for those who need to be on ARB to stop taking it because they believe it will hurt their ability to gain muscle.


“Out of eight ARBs, azilsartan and telmisartan exhibited good affinity to IGF-1 and MuRF-1 proteins.”

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

“The use of ARBs is associated with a reduction in frailty and age‐related loss of muscle mass and strength.”

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

Angiotensin II receptor blockade is associated with preserved muscle strength in chronic hemodialysis patients​

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

“Quite remarkable, ARB was able to prevent the loss of contractile force of tibialis anterior muscles overexpressing CTGF.“

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

 

[Stewie]

There's some chatter that some selective ARBs tinkers with myostatin. Substantial enough to facilitate as a hypertrophic adjuvant. No.

 

[Stewie]

Effect of Losartan on the Acute Response of Human Elderly... : Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise

ansforming growth factor-beta and up-regulation of insulin-like growth factor-1 signaling. Methods Twenty-eight healthy elderly men (+64 yr) were randomized into two groups, consuming either AT1R blocker (losartan, 100 mg·d−1) or placebo for 18 d before exercise. Participants performed one bout...

journals.lww.com

 

[juiceddunk2.0]

Think there are 2 school of thought here:

1. Don't take anything if it's not needed.

2. Take supps and Pharma meds prophylactically.

At age 50 I agree more with the later. This is because I want to keep "pushing" things a bit longer.

Now if a guy is 25 and will be done with super supps at age 35 then using items prophylactically is probably not needed. But.....to me it makes sense to prevent/minimize damage along the way especially if someone wants to make a "lifestyle" of it.

I am not saying it's smart or safe to use PED's as you get older but we are all "addicts" in a sense and if you are going to take compounds why not try to be as safe as possible while doing.

Along with my natural supps here is my Pharma support regimen:

40mg Telmisartan
5mg Cialis
10-12.5 Jardiance
5mg Crestor 2x/week
10mg Ezetimibe

thanks for the info bro @Reno911

 

[Type-IIx]

Just incase anyone still thinks an ARB will cause you to lose muscle or inhibit your ability to gain muscle (hypertrophy) I have posted the additional studies below. Humans and rats just for good measure and to not be biased.

If there are studies to directly support the counter argument I'm all ears.

I can add more if needed, but the last thing we need is for those who need to be on ARB to stop taking it because they believe it will hurt their ability to gain muscle.


“Out of eight ARBs, azilsartan and telmisartan exhibited good affinity to IGF-1 and MuRF-1 proteins.”

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

“The use of ARBs is associated with a reduction in frailty and age‐related loss of muscle mass and strength.”

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

Angiotensin II receptor blockade is associated with preserved muscle strength in chronic hemodialysis patients​

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

“Quite remarkable, ARB was able to prevent the loss of contractile force of tibialis anterior muscles overexpressing CTGF.“

Google Scholar

scholar.google.com

Kudos on your cherry-picking, outstanding. To be sure the data is only fairly characterized as mixed for ARBs but for ACE inhibitors all the data shows reduced hypertrophy.

 

[bbxtreme]

Kudos on your cherry-picking, outstanding. To be sure the data is only fairly characterized as mixed for ARBs but for ACE inhibitors all the data shows reduced hypertrophy.

Says the guy who’s yet to post a study supporting his “hypothesis” and only telling us we can purchase a paper in the future on it written by his truly.

For your article I take it your conducting studies to validate it since you’re not a fan of cherry picking…

As I said in the post I’m all ears if you have direct studies.

 

[Type-IIx]

Says the guy who’s yet to post a study supporting his “hypothesis” and only telling us we can purchase a paper in the future on it written by his truly.

For your article I take it your conducting studies to validate it since you’re not a fan of cherry picking…

As I said in the post I’m all ears if you have direct studies.

LOL you're not going to have to pay I just want to get paid for it by the publisher, and if it's not something he wants to run I'll publish it on my site. I have to conduct the research in my lab now for it to matter? OK hotshot

 

[bbxtreme]

LOL you're not going to have to pay I just want to get paid for it by the publisher, and if it's not something he wants to run I'll publish it on my site. I have to conduct the research in my lab now for it to matter? OK hotshot

But seriously, I only found those studies looking for articles to support your claim. I looked objectively.

Without what you call “cherry picking” you couldn’t write your article was my point. I love learning new things. I’ll eagerly wait to see your article and supporting studies. All is good.

 

[jaxino]

I am dumb as fuck.

So in the end Jardiance Is that good or not for bodybuilders? I don't understand sorry

 

[bbxtreme]

I am dumb as fuck.

So in the end Jardiance Is that good or not for bodybuilders? I don't understand sorry

If you’re pushing gear hard, stressing your heart and kidneys while having rising BG and A1C levels, yes it can be beneficial for a bodybuilder at that level.

 

[nothuman]

I am dumb as fuck.

So in the end Jardiance Is that good or not for bodybuilders? I don't understand sorry

Well the most common cause of death among bodybuilders is some type of cardiovascular issue, and Empagliflozin has proven to be one of the best therapeutics to prevent such issues, so taking it as a preventative makes a ton of sense to me. It’s also been shown to be very effective at extending the lifespan of mice, who don’t typically die of cardiovascular issues (and this has been repeated three times), signaling other benefits (to be fair they tested Canagliflozin instead, but Empagliflozin has better human evidence).

 

[danieltx]

If you’re pushing gear hard, stressing your heart and kidneys while having rising BG and A1C levels, yes it can be beneficial for a bodybuilder at that level.

Well the most common cause of death among bodybuilders is some type of cardiovascular issue, and Empagliflozin has proven to be one of the best therapeutics to prevent such issues, so taking it as a preventative makes a ton of sense to me. It’s also been shown to be very effective at extending the lifespan of mice, who don’t typically die of cardiovascular issues (and this has been repeated three times), signaling other benefits (to be fair they tested Canagliflozin instead, but Empagliflozin has better human evidence).

Do either of y'all have thoughts on or experience with Acarbose?

 

[bbxtreme]

Do either of y'all have thoughts on or experience with Acarbose?

@nothuman is your guy for that one. I only know surface level stuff about it.

For those who use it to help regulate blood sugar I do know it’s effective.

Personally I would avoid it if you have any digestive or liver issues as that’s usually the contraindications.

Acarbose - StatPearls - NCBI Bookshelf

 

[nothuman]

Do either of y'all have thoughts on or experience with Acarbose?

I've been using Acarbose for two years now. The way I do it is I eat four meals per day: first meal I take 10mg Jardiance, then meals 2-4 I take 50mg Acarbose (150mg per day but I'll take an extra if I have a cheat meal).

Acarbose and Metformin have similar effects on BG, but Acarbose showed SIGNIFICANT life extension in the ITP (3 mice studies repeated 3 times to validate the result), whereas Metformin didn't show any, unless it was combined with Rapamycin (Acarbose + Rapamycin had more profound benefits).

Therefore, I choose Acarbose since the differences don't seem to be that major for BG. My educated guess on why it performs better than Metformin for lifespan probably is related to microbiome improvements.

Side effects wise, it's the same as Metformin to me (having to use the bathroom more)

 

[slesh]

I am dumb as fuck.

So in the end Jardiance Is that good or not for bodybuilders? I don't understand sorry

Do either of y'all have thoughts on or experience with Acarbose?

@nothuman has me on both Jardiance and Acarbose.

From my own experience I wouldn’t not run Jardiance during a growth phase. It’s somewhat counterintuitive because of the massive glucose disposal. You really want to be focused on a storage hormone like Slin and supplement with some Berberine when you outside the window. However during maintenance or a cut I find both of the above to be fantastic especially when running high GH.

 

[nothuman]

@nothuman has me on both Jardiance and Acarbose.

From my own experience I wouldn’t not run Jardiance during a growth phase. It’s somewhat counterintuitive because of the massive glucose disposal. You really want to be focused on a storage hormone like Slin and supplement with some Berberine when you outside the window. However during maintenance or a cut I find both of the above to be fantastic especially when running high GH.

Ah yea good point. Important to note I don't have insulin use in mind when I'm talking about taking Jardiance. That's something I don't feel too comfortable speaking about since I haven't used any insulin in over 10 years, and certainly didn't use it with jardiance at the time. Someone actually PMed me about combining them and I told him I didn't have a good answer to that.

 

[bbxtreme]

Ah yea good point. Important to note I don't have insulin use in mind when I'm talking about taking Jardiance. That's something I don't feel too comfortable speaking about since I haven't used any insulin in over 10 years, and certainly didn't use it with jardiance at the time. Someone actually PMed me about combining them and I told him I didn't have a good answer to that.

I personally would not use it on a growth phase WITH insulin. Your goal is glycogen storage and you would be taking something that is trying to prevent that. The short time I tried it I was pissing like a race horse. Lol

For guys who don’t use insulin or if you’re cutting I think it can be beneficial as BG starts to climb. You just need to ensure you’re keeping electrolytes in and fluid intake high.